19 Patron ?!

[DaoKakao]

@lesley said in 19 Patron ?!:

in bitnami

This is virtually same thing :) Looks great!

As for me, Docker containers looks more preferable, however

[lesley]

Yeah, I just don't know how many users will know how to use docker.

[DaoKakao]

So, it would be nice to provide (potential)customers with all possible choises :)

[Traumflug]

@wakabayashi said in 19 Patron ?!:

Sure 10$ a month is also nothing if you want to become an online shop. But not many merchants are thinking the way you are

Well, I think much of this has to do with how people recognize open source software. For many years, since the idea of open sourcing software came up, the paradigm was "See, it's free as in beer, so it's always cheaper. And it's open, so it magically heals its self!". This paradigm got serious cracks over the last few years. One of these cracks is software complexity, even talented developers can no longer dive into the code for fixing some issue within a couple of hours. Dedicated developers are needed, and they need food on the table, so they have to get paid.

With the need to pay for open source software users/customers open up a simple comparison: "Why should I pay for this open source thing if I can get another software for the same money which comes with developers responsible for fixing it?" And they still have this original open source paradigm in their mind.

The new paradigm of open source software is the emphasis on that open source software is safer and more reliable. It certainly is, because many more eyes look at it. At least all these eyes can look at it.

Maybe it sounds snobbish, but people have to learn that "free" no longer means "zero money". They have to contribute something, either in form of money or in form of bug fixes and feature enhancements.

How to get there? Crowdfunding looks very promising, IMHO, at least for feature enhancements. While I'm not part of the target audience for the Elastic Search module I'm very glad to have seen a successful funding.

And Patreons are those caring about reliability as well as constant small improvements. Getting people into recognizing that their $10/month is an excellent investment as it allows people like @mdekker, @lesley (or even me) to spend their time wading through Github issues, pick them up one by one and getting them fixed.

Maybe bugs reported by Patreons should be fixed with priority? Might be a good strategy to get the idea spread.

[Traumflug]

@daokakao said:

Just a small preamble: @alwayspaws experiences a difficulties as with local environment setup as with the shared hosting (because most of them has some limits, more or less weird/concerning), and, as an ordinary merchant she’s not the only one who faced such kind of troubles.

Yes, I'm aware of this and it's unfortunate. But I don't see how using a VPS could fix this. Especially on a local setup she has all the powerful knobs at her disposal, even more than on a VPS. Possessing these knobs is obviously not sufficient.

Like always, these issues have to be fixed one by one in the software.

Let me take this opportunity to say a big THANK YOU to @alwayspaws for reporting all of them (instead of walking away).

[vincentdenkspel]

@traumflug i also think that crowdfunding i a good way. However, not in the way ES was funded. My second post of will be about that. I hope to post it tonight or somewhere tomorrow. The post will be called ‘3000% funded’

[Traumflug]

@daokakao said in 19 Patron ?!:

So, it would be nice to provide (potential)customers with all possible choises

More choices mean a steeper learning curve. Not sure whether this would be helpful for users like @alwayspaws .

I'd tend more towards "software should figure all these choices on its own".

[dynambee]

Personally I am very pleased with the progress on the 30bz project and I have huge appreciation for @lesley and @mdekker. I'm also a programmer (though not PHP unfortunately) so I understand the difficulties presented by a project of this size. It will take time to fix all the problems that PS created while also adding new modules and features.

I hope we will see more people step up to support the project on Patreon but I do think $5000 a month is a difficult goal for a project still in its infancy like 30bz is. Getting the 30bz store up and running is probably the most important step right now. It will show not only the selection of modules available but also the store fees will help support the project.

[alwayspaws]

@Traumflug Let me take this opportunity to say a big THANK YOU to @alwayspaws for reporting all of them (instead of walking away).

Thanks very much @Traumflug I deeply appreciate this.

The rest of this post has been edited. I'm going to go about doing what I need to, to get this site going.

[dynambee]

@alwayspaws, No one needs to contribute, especially those who don't have a functioning website yet! You're a great member of this site and have been kind & helpful to many people. There are more ways to contribute than with money and I'm certain I'm not the only one who values your contributions on the forums.

[vincentdenkspel]

@alwayspaws If my post upset you than i sorry about that. That was not my intention. However if this indeed the case than i must say i don't understand why. I wrote "I’M NOT TALKING ABOUT THE PEOPLE THAT DO CONTRIBUTE BIG TIME TO TB BY SOLVING BUGS/CODING ETC." I think you make valuable contributions, so no need to be upset.

However i do think that there are various people that only take and do not give at all in any sort of way

[DaoKakao]

@traumflug said in 19 Patron ?!:

Yes, I’m aware of this and it’s unfortunate. But I don’t see how using a VPS could fix this.

Not VPS, but pre-bundled and preconfigured image where most options and setting are set already up. Above i’ve mentioned the bitrix. For a long time they been very niche-ish product, but last 2-3years they did a huge leap on the market. Talking with my friends (either experienced programmers either merchants) i’ve figured out that this happen thank to making that preconfigured image, greatly reducing deployment time and maintenance costs.

Especially on a local setup she has all the powerful knobs at her disposal I tried to help her, observing the apache config and local .htaccess via TeamViewer - and i have no idea, why this damn 404 appears when SEO torn on. Even TB's automatically generated .htaccess doesn't affects this issue.

Summarising, i see the situation following way: If you developer or hacker-enthusiast, then you don't need neither bundled software, nor VPS/DS. Contrary, if you merchant/businessman then you don't care much about apache/system tuning - all you need is the turnkey solution.

[Briljander]

Interesting post.

I do agree in some parts.

I am contributing with $5 and do read the forums everyday even though Im still on Prestashop.

I think there are to many risks at this moment to change and also I am afraid that the developer's behind my modules won't give me support if I change platform.

But I do still think this is a really interesting project and hope it will gain more active people working on it.

[dynambee]

@briljander, which modules are you using currently?

[alwayspaws]

Part of this conversation has cut me to the bone. The idea of if you can’t afford to donate a little bit of money you should think about why you have a website shocks me. The point of life in my opinion is to have goals and work toward them. Not throw in the towel. I am not directing my comment toward any individual but to this overall conversation.

[dynambee]

@alwayspaws said in 19 Patron ?!:

Part of this conversation has cut me to the bone. The idea of if you can’t afford to donate a little bit of money you should think about why you have a website shocks me. The point of life in my opinion is to have goals and work toward them. Not throw in the towel. I am not directing my comment toward any individual but to this overall conversation.

I really feel those comments were directed at people who have a functioning website that is making money. Ideally that is what all eCommerce websites should be doing but it takes time, effort, and trial & error to get to that point.

I don’t think anyone here expects people who are still on the road to having a functioning website to be putting money into Patreon.

[dynambee]

@alwayspaws, I also sent you a bunch of chat messages, please have a look when you can.

[Traumflug]

@daokakao said in 19 Patron ?!:

Not VPS, but pre-bundled and preconfigured image where most options and setting are set already up.

If such a preconfiguration can be put into a bundle I see no reason why this couldn't be put into an installer, too.

[alwayspaws]

@dynambee said in 19 Patron ?!:

@alwayspaws, No one needs to contribute, especially those who don't have a functioning website yet! You're a great member of this site and have been kind & helpful to many people. There are more ways to contribute than with money and I'm certain I'm not the only one who values your contributions on the forums.

Thank you!

[alwayspaws]

@vincentdenkspel said in 19 Patron ?!:

However i do think that there are various people that only take and do not give at all in any sort of way.

I understand that and thank you. I know what your intentions are and they are commendable, especially if they are read by the people who should absorb this info.

[alwayspaws]

@daokakao said in 19 Patron ?!:

if you merchant/businessman then you don’t care much about apache/system tuning - all you need is the turnkey solution.

Absolutely agree.

[alwayspaws]

@dynambee said in 19 Patron ?!:

@alwayspaws, I also sent you a bunch of chat messages, please have a look when you can.

Thank you very much. I just saw them and replied.

[alwayspaws]

@traumflug said in 19 Patron ?!:

@daokakao said in 19 Patron ?!:

Not VPS, but pre-bundled and preconfigured image where most options and setting are set already up.

If such a preconfiguration can be put into a bundle I see no reason why this couldn't be put into an installer, too.

I vote for that! Of course, now with this forum topic, I may become wary about being enthusiastic about great ideas since they all cost someone time / money.

[lesley]

About the images, to be honest we need them lots of places. We need a good docker image, we need a bitnami image, we need an AMI image in their library. Kubernates would also be an interesting one to get into as well. They just take time and people that know how to package them.

[Briljander]

@dynambee I do have a lot of different modules which are not supported here from

2N Technologies Globosoftware Blog from Prestahome (included in warehouse theme) Mypresta emagicone (Prestashop store manager) Proquality newsletter Presta-lab Onasus Linea Grafica Kahanit

But the ones that concerns me the most are those that are local. For example shipping and payments modules for Nordic countries.